Mark Burik (00:01.772)
Hey everyone out there in podcast land. My name is Mark Burik and I am here with my guest today, Marine Kinna, and she's not just a guest, but she is a future host of many of these podcasts as well as anything else we got going on with Better Beach. So I'm personally thrilled to announce that Marines joined our team.
and she's in full time and she is our camp coordinator and she is using her digital marketing degree to help us out and to help spread the word of beach volleyball through our company and help us organize camps and make any of our online services better, easier to find and all of that good stuff. But for this particular episode, what we're going to be talking about is actually the recruiting scene.
for NCAA and since she is originally from France, she has a unique path to number one, getting into the NCAA, going through all of that recruiting stuff with coaches, with governments, with visas, and then what it's like to be an international player here.
how she finds work, how she pays for the education, how she competes, and all of the problems that come along with that. And then afterwards, now that she's got that education, there's a whole slew of paperwork and visas that we're all still going through and that she's had to put herself through with international lawyers and everything. So we really want to talk a lot about that and get a unique perspective on an international player coming over to the US through college.
then competing on the AVP and working and getting involved in the American beach volleyball scene. And so that's what we're going to be talking about today. But before we get started, I just want to tell you guys a upcoming camps that we have. And we have got a lot now that Marines on the team, it's going to open us up to be able to run a lot more camps. So number one, if you are a high level player or coach, or you even want to train.
Mark Burik (02:15.466)
as a coach and you want to become a better at beach coach. We would love to train you to see you in action and to have some help running some of our camps. Cause we have AVP players, national team coaches, AVP coaches who are currently running our camps. And we want to add to our staff and send you around the country and hopefully around the world to help players get better at beach. So if you want to be a part of that, number one, you should probably check out the site.
betteratbeach .com forward slash coach and you can see all about how we help our coaches because you have to become a part of the Coach Academy so that you can learn from us and then we're also gonna be coming up with some coaching clinics in the future. So very specifically coaching clinics and if you have any interest in that at all, at attending a coaching clinic, just DM me at mark berg on Instagram and just let me know that you're interested.
so that we can fire it up as quickly as we can and hit the ground running. But upcoming camps for our players. September 13th to 15th, that's today. Today, right now is in Asheville, North Carolina, so that's already happening. You're probably too late. But September 23rd to 27th, we're partnering with Queen and King of the Court for their Queen and King of the Court event in Miami, Florida. So we've got five days of...
clinics leading up to that. And then you can see me and Brandon competing, probably starting out in the qualifier. So if you want to see me dust off the rust and attempt to play volleyball, you're more than welcome to come to Miami from the 23rd to the 27th. Then October 11th to 13th, we've got a three day mini camp for men's B and double B players. So that's at my private court.
In Florida, in St. Petersburg, it's one court, it's got an Airbnb on it, it's got a nice beautiful hot tub, a giant swim spa, a little weight set and an outdoor shower. So if you're planning on coming to Florida, want to come to Florida, or you live in the St. Pete area and want to attend, we only have 12 spots because it's only one court. And J Plummer, local legend, is going to be running that one. In Austin, Texas, October 18th to 20th, we have men's and women's B double B.
Mark Burik (04:31.834)
and Women's B double B October 18th to 20th as well, but that's happening in Grand Sands in Loveland, Ohio. Our Halloween camp from October 27th to November 3rd is going to be in St. Pete Beach. We are going to be at the Dolphin Resort. So we're changing hotels. PCI is under renovation and we are going to actually better sand bigger resorts. I'm really excited about this move to Dolphin Resort in St. Pete Beach.
And then November 8th to 10th in Virginia Beach and the 15th to 17th back in Loveland, Ohio at Grand Sands, November 15th to 17th also in St. Pete. But this time it's a women's B double B that's in Florida. And I am headed home to Long Island, New York. I'm from Queens, but I'm going home and I will be in Long Island at New York with some of my East coast buddies. And we will be running the show from November 22nd.
24th. So if you're in Long Island or the New York area and want to come train for three days just before Thanksgiving, bring it on. And that very same weekend, we have a three -day camp for all levels and ages in Scottsdale, Arizona, followed by the very next week, our all -inclusive trip to Punta Cana, Dominican Republic.
It's gonna be awesome. I think we have five men's spots left and maybe seven women's spots left. So I invite you guys to come. then lastly, we have opened up our private lessons, our private video lessons where you can get your videos analyzed. We can look at your games. We can make a game plan for you and give you the most limiting things that are happening in your match and tell you quickly how to fix it. So our roster is now open.
And if you had to better beach .com forward slash film session, you can book a private lesson with me or Brandon and really try to bump up your game and get a watchful eye looking at your skill, your technique, or even if you just want to customize workout program, we can help you design that and we will design it for you in those private sessions. So that's everything we've got going on for the 2024 season and.
Mark Burik (06:48.898)
We're adding more. So if you want to come and coach, or if you want to come to any of those camps, or if you want us to run something in your neighborhood, Marine's going to help us do that. So just shoot us a DM or email support at better beach .com without further ado, Marine Kinna's first ever podcast. Welcome Marine.
Marine Kinna (07:10.472)
Yay, the crowd. Thank you, thank you. Happy to be here. Happy to be part of the team.
Mark Burik (07:15.85)
Good. Yeah, that's, I'm grateful for you. I'm grateful that you've learned so much so fast. I did the little of a DJ's throwing spaghetti at you and hoping as much sticks as possible. so I'm looking forward to that. And what I, what I really want to talk about to start off with is when you're playing in France and
correct me if I'm wrong, it's sport doesn't come first as a French person in France the same way that it does, you know, where in the US you have people getting private lessons for their four year olds thinking, gotta pay for college, gotta get a division one scholarship. So correct me if I'm wrong there, but you also came from an athletic family. And what gave you the drive or reason
Marine Kinna (08:09.138)
Mm
Mark Burik (08:14.53)
to try to start playing in the US? And then what is the system like starting out in beach volleyball or even indoor volleyball in France?
Marine Kinna (08:25.608)
Yeah, 100%. I mean, France, like you said, it is not, I wouldn't say it's not a sports country. think people do sports, but I don't think they do. It's not as important as it is in the U S like people are going to do sport on Sunday. They're going to go play battle tennis. They're going to go have fun, but it's not as competitive as it is in the U S. But I also think that in the U S because college is so expensive.
Sports is a way to get free education. But for me, I came from an athletic family. My mom played tennis, my dad played volleyball. So I grew up playing tennis my entire life. And then when I was 14, started playing volleyball. In volleyball, there's only, in France, there's only like eight high school that specialize in volleyball where you're gonna practice.
Mark Burik (08:58.19)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (09:24.474)
every day with a school team basically and so you all year round but
Mark Burik (09:26.146)
Well.
Like all year round?
Well, so is that like Vong in Norway, like the Norwegian, the Norwegian high school where it's you're there in that high school just for beach volleyball? Is it like that? Okay.
Marine Kinna (09:42.8)
It's similar. Yeah, yeah, it's it's similar. It'll be specialized high school that have it's not only for volleyball, like certain schools have different sport, but I'll be like a specialized school for athletes. So when I first started after my first year playing indoor, I got recruited in one of those high school, which was far like the closest from my house was about three hours away. And then I didn't get recruited to that one. So I end up being
Five hours away in the middle of France, I was in boarding school and then I was in a host family in the weekend because I couldn't go home. Yeah, it was intense because I really wanted to play.
Mark Burik (10:23.542)
You can't even stay at the high school during the weekends.
Marine Kinna (10:27.238)
No, not in my certain high school you could because their facility was right outside the high school. But in my high school, I couldn't stay because my boarding school was related to my high school. So it was pretty intense. But through that, I also was playing through a club in the weekend, which was a pro club indoor. So I was able to gain to get
Mark Burik (10:41.367)
Okay.
Marine Kinna (10:57.394)
Pretty good, pretty fast because of I was playing volleyball all the time, basically. But yeah.
Mark Burik (10:58.956)
Mm.
Yeah, you always have a coach's eye on you. You're playing nonstop and that's, it's almost impossible not to get better quick there.
Marine Kinna (11:10.312)
Yeah, 100%. But the different here, but also like, since there's only eight high school around, maybe more now, I'm not sure the exact number, but the teams is probably like 15 girls. So it's not that many girls are not going to all of those high school, if that makes sense. You know, a lot of volleyball players don't have access to that because first of all, it's expensive. You still have to pay for boarding school. Like there's no scholarships.
you you pay for a boarding school, like if I'm in another state, technically, another region of France, so you still need some kind of funding because there's a host family, like you need to get food, you need something. So it's an investment, not as going into college, but I would say like a year cost around $2 ,000.
Mark Burik (11:39.725)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (12:07.364)
euros which in the US is probably nothing but but in France yeah yeah
Mark Burik (12:10.222)
Yeah, because I'm thinking about my my high school, I think was I went to a private high school and that was maybe four to 5000 a month then. And I imagine it has to have like, I don't know, it doubled by now. I'm not completely positive. But yeah, there are definitely more high schools that are super expensive.
Marine Kinna (12:17.106)
Mm
Marine Kinna (12:21.564)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (12:32.584)
100%. But in France, just think that sport is viewed as free. So like, if you have a coach, it's a volunteer. You know, like they don't get something out of it. You know, it's not like, I'm going to go book that coach because he's great. No, it's like, this is the coach of the club. You're going to play for that club. That's it.
Mark Burik (12:56.396)
Hmm. How do clubs exist in France? they through, do they have local sponsorships, like local companies that are there supporting them? Is there government funding? Because I know in Norway where I played indoor, just to have a club, so long as you included certain programs, the government gave you money to organize that club.
Marine Kinna (13:12.39)
Mm
Marine Kinna (13:18.984)
Yeah, it's local funding, really local sponsored. think the CD helps. I do think so. I'm not 100 % sure. never been like in the outside, like inside of making a club, but it's definitely local sponsors, volunteer, like I said, volunteer coach. Like if there's events like hosting games, there's a lot of volunteers everywhere. Like it's more like
passion that I give honestly, and then that will create a club.
Mark Burik (13:49.902)
Sure.
Yeah, so the idea of a kid paying like 150, 200 bucks an hour for a private lesson in France is sounds like crazy.
Marine Kinna (14:00.166)
It doesn't exist. There's just, I don't even think it's something like, don't even know if it's an option, honestly.
Mark Burik (14:08.61)
I remember I went to Paris, not Paris volley, but there's a beach club in Paris, maybe it was with my good buddy Pierre Basse and he was just like, I don't think you're gonna get people to pay for training here. And I was like, what do mean? It's gonna be like a six hour training. Like I'm gonna be out there sweating and teaching and everything. He goes, no one pays to learn sports in this country.
Marine Kinna (14:13.074)
senses then maybe.
Marine Kinna (14:18.534)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (14:27.111)
Mm
Marine Kinna (14:37.116)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.
Mark Burik (14:38.728)
And I was like, all right. So I just went and did a free clinic. We had as many people as we could. And then we had some, you know, Vaughn and fromage afterwards.
Marine Kinna (14:46.408)
Yeah. Yeah, I think like, maybe you can, like, for example, a camp like or three day something will be like, 100 200 euros, max. That's like pushing. That's like pushing the limits. And I do think it's getting better. Because they see how other country do it. But
Mark Burik (14:57.069)
Hmm.
Mark Burik (15:11.115)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (15:14.79)
before, like when I was growing up and like indoor, it was definitely, there was no like private lesson type of thing, you know, but.
Mark Burik (15:22.904)
See, this is wild to me because I'm number one, Pro A France is, that was one of my dreams to play Pro A France. I got recruited to play Pro B and was like a day away from flying to the club and then they decided to go with somebody else. And so I was like, man, I lost that dream of playing in France. But when you're playing in Pro A compared to the leagues that I was in, so I played in Croatia, Sweden, Norway, the,
The guys that were hitting the ball. mean, it's like 10, 15 miles per hour faster on their arms and the angles were insane. So pro a France for indoor is an insanely high level of volleyball and you know, men's and women's. So how does that come about when
Marine Kinna (16:06.312)
Mm
Mark Burik (16:15.758)
And I tend to think that some of the French coaches are geniuses. And the way that you guys think about it, I even follow a tennis coach. I don't even know his last name, but I follow like Morgan lot to, he's got like 2 million followers, but they talk so much about. I dominance and how to position their players and like change positions and change technique versus.
dependent on which eye is dominant. And even something like that, go, there's no American coach who I've ever heard mention a thing about, which is your stronger eye. so I tend to think that the coaching programs there are elite because you've got crazy elite teams and France for the Olympics is always in the medal rounds.
Marine Kinna (16:54.233)
Mm
Marine Kinna (17:05.734)
Yeah, I mean, the men's side won two times in a row, which is amazing. And I think it's also why on the men's side, like the sports grew so much. The women's side, think we're getting there, like, because we hosted the Olympics, we obviously had a spot for the indoor team. But I think the girls are getting better, stronger. But I think the difference at an early age of what friends do is
Mark Burik (17:11.107)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (17:35.592)
As soon as you get better, as soon as you're like the coach see potential, they're going to put you in an adult team. So you're going to play with people that have a lot of experience and you're going to learn from them. yeah. And like at 13 years old, was playing with adult, like not 13, like 14, 15, I was playing with adults and like playing with adults at that early age, you learn from them. You learn from like their experience. And also.
Mark Burik (17:48.451)
Huh.
Mark Burik (18:02.828)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (18:04.424)
Because France in their pro league, have to have a quota of French people in the team. that gets, so like people like me, when I was growing up at 16, 17, when I was in that high school, I was able to play pro on the bench, but I was still able to be there, get to all the practices, have pro coaching at an early age and play with those international players that were coming to France to play.
Mark Burik (18:10.518)
Okay.
Mark Burik (18:20.64)
Hmm.
Mark Burik (18:30.04)
Wow.
Marine Kinna (18:33.488)
and I was able to practice with them because the system helped me. Yeah. And I'm like, yeah, it was insane. Yeah. And but the coaches treat you like them. Like you've heard about like, I mean, you've probably been coached by Europeans. It's they're just they push you. They're they're pretty they're pretty tough. They're not going to try to make you feel better about yourself.
Mark Burik (18:33.934)
Yeah. And they're 15 years stronger than you, bigger than you, more experienced and you got to pick it up quick.
Mark Burik (18:55.106)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (19:00.712)
They just, I cried couple of times. Yeah, but it's a different approach, I think, than the American coaches. It's more like rapes, reps like. But I do think it's working in a way that now like French play are getting better and better.
Mark Burik (19:00.92)
You
Mark Burik (19:05.496)
We all have, yeah.
Mark Burik (19:26.584)
Yeah. Hmm. Yeah. Do you, this is one of the questions that I'm like really interested in. because when we talk about German coaches, any Eastern block coaches, like, Croatian when I went there, Russian coaches, even the Russians that come to our camps who have now moved to Seattle, they're like, stop.
Marine Kinna (19:39.802)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (19:47.218)
Mm -hmm.
Mark Burik (19:49.838)
Complimenting me stop telling me nice rep like when I hit the ball on my forearms like tell me what I'm doing wrong and it's it's cultural I think because if you grow up thinking that this is the this is the way you're taught and the way to get better then you actually believe in that a little bit more whereas somebody like me for from New York for example coming out to California for the first however many years anytime somebody gave me a compliment I was like I didn't trust them. I thought
Marine Kinna (19:54.514)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (19:59.036)
Mm
Marine Kinna (20:06.938)
Yeah. Yeah.
Mark Burik (20:19.638)
You know, they're up to something, you know, because usually it's followed. Like you get a compliment followed by an insult because they're making fun of you. And then you insult them back. then now we're having a conversation. but coming out to California, it got, it is true. It's, it's real soft. and so I had to adjust to that. And then the Russians who come to our camps where we're promoting community and positivity and everything, they're like,
Marine Kinna (20:20.2)
But yeah.
Marine Kinna (20:25.701)
Yeah, yeah.
Marine Kinna (20:34.92)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.
Mark Burik (20:45.228)
I need you to yell at me a little bit. So then we send them over to DJ and JM and we're like, we're gonna give you the flat coaches that are tough on you. And then anybody who wants to smile, come on over here. So for like American coaches, Brazilian coaches, I don't know any other like nationality coaches, but do you find any, what are the style differences that you've personally noticed?
Marine Kinna (20:48.648)
He gets.
Marine Kinna (20:56.868)
Yeah, no, I mean
Marine Kinna (21:05.64)
Mm
Marine Kinna (21:11.654)
Yeah, it's, I think everyone is different. Like even like similar, like European have similar coaches, but I do think that every coach has a different way of, of coaching. and I do think that not every player are going to like the same coaching, you know, especially in beach volleyball, like you kind of have the choice to pick what you want. Like in indoor, it's a big team. So you kind of.
Mark Burik (21:31.149)
Yeah,
Marine Kinna (21:39.228)
go with it and it doesn't affect you as much, I believe, but in beach volleyball, it's only a couple of people, like two. And then I think the coaching style affects you more. But how I see it now, it's American style is more like understanding why, like it's more like, like you did that, like why? And how I got coached so far. And also it's more like, this is great.
Mark Burik (21:42.018)
Mm
Mark Burik (22:02.531)
Mm.
Marine Kinna (22:08.656)
Like this is good. It's always like positive, and more like play play like style drills. Brazilian it's reps reps reps cardio. let's see how many times you can hit that spot while you're tired, for example. which is also good. And then European, think it's technique reps like.
Mark Burik (22:17.58)
Okay.
Marine Kinna (22:39.204)
a little slower but more like no no no this was good like but it's more like like no do it again do it again do it again do it again do it again until you actually get it
Mark Burik (22:54.872)
So is there an obsession with technique over decision making in the stereotypical European coach in your experience?
Marine Kinna (23:03.484)
Yeah, I think early on they will try to fix your technique. but I do think that afterwards, like when you're playing professional, they're not going to try to fix your technique anymore. They're mostly going to try to fix your finishes. It's like, okay, if this is your way of hitting that line, that's fine. But just, you have to be able to hit that line over and over and over again. So it's.
Mark Burik (23:29.922)
Yeah. I'd say if you get to that level, if you get to that high level, like your techniques, probably it's got it done. You know, it has gotten it done and you look at like, okay, Phil Dozer. All right. He's winning AVPs and he's two years into the AVP. It's like, Hey man, should we fix your approach? Should we, you know, should we like get you off of the goofy foot? you just say like, okay, Hey, this has gotten you this far and you can either go through.
Marine Kinna (23:34.01)
Yes, if you get to that high level.
Yes. Yeah.
Marine Kinna (23:50.618)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Mark Burik (23:59.692)
two years, maybe, maybe a year of recalibrating, relearning, teaching your nervous system to do something completely different and then perfecting that. Or, hey, this is what you got. This is what we're gonna continue on and now we're gonna get as good as possible from there. Unless I think if there's something that's super limiting, obviously.
Marine Kinna (24:18.024)
Mm
Mark Burik (24:25.466)
You know, pick it apart, give them the reminders of good technique just in case you start getting lazy during practice. hmm. Okay. Yeah. That's kind of, that's kind of been my experience as well. more, a lot more conversational with American coaches and getting into the, think maybe we've overdone it with, I'm not saying that like mental health is the wrong way to go, but we might be.
Marine Kinna (24:25.936)
Yeah, they will try to correct. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Marine Kinna (24:44.349)
Mm -hmm.
Mark Burik (24:54.19)
sliding to being a little bit too soft. Like let's have enough conversation and start playing because I could tell you how to play volleyball for 10 years. And until you do it for 10 years, you're not going to have that. if you keep having extended conversation during practices like me, I'm a work mentality. just let's go reps. I do want to understand it, but that's my water break.
Marine Kinna (25:03.656)
Mm
Mark Burik (25:19.806)
As I'm drinking water, I want to know the why just so that can apply it in the future and so that I could teach it. I've always known that I wanted to be a coach. enjoy coaching. So I'm like, how do I help get what you're trying to get me to do into another athlete and why? So I always wanted the why, but never once did I interrupt practice and stop things to be like, it was always during a water breaker after practice, hunt down the coach and say like, get me into your brain, please.
Marine Kinna (25:34.728)
Mm
Marine Kinna (25:46.246)
Yeah. No, but to add onto that, I do think that every coaching style has its time in the season. You know, I do think that it's good to know why if you're trying to fix something. And I do think that once you know why, then let's do the reps. Once you've done the reps, okay, let's, let's do the reps and like, let's get you exhausted while doing the reps.
Mark Burik (25:54.605)
Hmm.
Mark Burik (26:11.166)
Mm.
Marine Kinna (26:11.558)
You know, I do think that there is a time that I think that everyone should experience different coaching style to see what works for them. but yeah, it's, it's still different. Everyone is different. Every coach is different, but I think we can get better while you have a coach. Any coach could get you better. Yes. All of them are results.
Mark Burik (26:26.199)
and
And all of them have results, you know, like USS gold medals, like a European style is gold medals. Brazilian's got a ton of gold medals. So it's all working. There's way more than one way to coach way more than one way to teach a technique or connect with an athlete. And it's just up to the coach. think that coaching, should be comfortable.
Marine Kinna (26:37.981)
Yeah.
Mark Burik (26:54.162)
in your own skin and say, okay, I have my personality, but at the same time, don't just say, this is who I am, this is how I coach. Know who you're turning off, know who you're turning on and study that as well. Like every time you lose an athlete or every time some athlete just, don't get along with them, figure out why so that if there's one word or a different way to phrase something, yeah.
Marine Kinna (26:56.21)
Mm
Marine Kinna (27:07.346)
Mm
Marine Kinna (27:11.09)
Mm -hmm.
Mark Burik (27:23.242)
learn how to hold on to that athlete or to that team member. And I lost a lot of athletes because I coached for a while the same way that I trained. Just put your head down, let's go. You're injured, so what? You're sick, so what? Get it done, show up. And that's how I treat a lot of my life. But if you treat your players exclusively like that, there are the ones that you just lose. And they're like, he doesn't care about me. He didn't even say, how are you?
Marine Kinna (27:48.413)
Mm
Yeah.
Mark Burik (27:53.206)
You I'm like, well, I see you, you're standing, you're probably fine, right? Yeah. Yeah. So I've had to calibrate my coaching then as well. Like my coaching turned into a big business. now how do I create other coaches that can create a community? our, our whole.
Marine Kinna (27:55.304)
No, 100%. 100%. I agree.
Mark Burik (28:14.86)
Our whole style is community. Can the players from our camp meet each other and in three days have somebody's house to stay in across the country. And we've done that successfully. And I'm proud of that because that's how my career went as well. It's like, you make friends somewhere. Okay, now you've got a couch to sleep on in California. How cool is that? So let's promote that. Cause I think some people are, it's tough to make friends as an adult. really is.
Marine Kinna (28:23.964)
Thank
Marine Kinna (28:30.418)
Mm
Marine Kinna (28:37.928)
No, 100%. Yeah, no, it is 100%. And I do even for us, like, I've been I coached to so many camps and like, now our roommates are from better at beach. That's pretty insane. Like, it's pretty insane. And like, it's so cool. Like as a coach, like when I went to Chicago, when I went to any ADP, like so many people from better at beach came and talked to me.
Mark Burik (28:51.246)
No, that's
Marine Kinna (29:06.78)
They were just like so excited to just see me play because they saw me coach and they just looked like, hey, like this was, and it's great a feeling. It's a great feeling, honestly. And that's one of the things I love about camps on this. It's meeting the people.
Mark Burik (29:13.544)
Nice.
Mark Burik (29:20.366)
And then after volleyball, lasts, for some people it lasts your whole life, but for some people, the competitive phase where you're going after it, you know, to me it lasted until I was 37, 38, and then I don't really have competitive juice. Now I just have play juice left. You know, like I want to play sports. Do I really?
Marine Kinna (29:32.605)
Mm -hmm.
Marine Kinna (29:38.105)
Mm
Mark Burik (29:41.87)
want to go through three 12 hour days in another place away from my family just to maybe make a few thousand bucks like and it's a very maybe I spent all of that hardcore competitiveness and now I'm just like I'm playing and it's and it's still they're enjoyable in different ways but accepting that was
Marine Kinna (29:56.637)
Mm
Mark Burik (30:06.638)
was hard. And I think it took one speech from Wayne Gretzky where he was talking about playing with his kids. And he goes, yeah, I've seen the Michael Jordan documentary where he's still picking fights and laying down bets at, know, 55, 60 years old and getting like super aggressive and telling LeBron that he would still beat him. And then Wayne Gretzky was like, yeah, I saw that documentary. He goes, me and Mike are not the same, two of the greatest in their sports of all time. And he's like,
Once I was done playing, I was done competing. I will be out on any lake, any rink and be happily there, but I don't need to score any more points than anybody else anymore. And I'm really happy with it. And so that one podcast was like, okay, I can, I can settle myself down and not think that anything's like wrong with me for not feeling that crazy competitive juice. And I still have the drive. still have the,
Marine Kinna (30:57.402)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.
Mark Burik (31:02.766)
work ethic, I think has carried into other things. yeah, regardless, we've gone a bit off track. So let's get back to Maureen as a 13, 14, 15 year old playing in high school saying, what's the next step? And who mentions that first? When did the whispers of coming to the US to play beach volleyball start?
Marine Kinna (31:16.038)
Yes.
Marine Kinna (31:19.975)
Mm -hmm.
Marine Kinna (31:30.086)
Yeah. So like I said, my dad was playing indoor volleyball and him growing up, actually went to an American high school in Greece. he always had, yeah, a long story, but he always, so my dad always had a connection to the USA. So he already know like kind of the system, how sports and classes work.
When I was 16, 17, I believe that he told me about it. He was just like, have you ever thought like, you should go play in the US, like it's be so fun. You get to play and you get to study at the same time. And it's made for it, which in the opposite in France, we had, we have a really hard time finding the for school and sport, high level sport to be compatible.
Mark Burik (32:28.6)
Mm.
Marine Kinna (32:28.924)
they don't get along. Since we're not a sports country and you don't play for your school like in the US, the school don't really care and the club don't really care if you don't study. They pay you to play. So they don't really care if you don't succeed in your studies. So I had two choices. I had one choice to go pro indoor, stay in France, or
Mark Burik (32:43.043)
Mm.
Marine Kinna (32:56.486)
And try to study. I knew as a woman, professional athletes, that it's not forever. And I knew I wanted to have an education. And it was something also mandatory from my parents. They're like, we want you to go to school. And I wanted to study. I really wanted to have something out of it. Because you never know what happened in high level sport. All of a sudden an injury happened and then you're out. It's over.
So I wanted to have a backup plan. So I started.
Mark Burik (33:31.042)
That's so mature. I had none of that. I was just like, I'm going to college for sports. And then they told me that I could study sports while I played sports in college. was like, exercise science? Yes.
Marine Kinna (33:33.448)
Yeah, but I do also think...
Marine Kinna (33:44.296)
Yeah, no, but I get it and then also I do think as a man's pro volleyball like when you go overseas you can still make a good amount of money as a Woman I was on the side outside hater. Yes, I'm self 511 but the girls are getting taller and taller and then and I Knew that I would never
get to the best league, like I would never go to Italy or play in Turkey or the best women leagues. I could still go like play a professional in France and like other country probably, but I would never touch those high, high salaries that I could always live from and like put aside and kind of have couple years if I'm done after and have money on the side. Like it will be like a regular job salary. That's how women's sport volleyball is at the moment.
which is fun while you play, but then once you're done, I wanted to have a backup plan. Yeah. So, actually my dad, when you mentioned me that, he contacted, a sports agency who is sense athletes, in the U S they're mostly known for tennis because it was already something that happens in tennis couple of all the ball players, but.
Mark Burik (34:45.718)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (35:09.072)
not a lot and they kind of guide me through the journey of how to get recruited for indoor volleyball.
Mark Burik (35:17.934)
Do you think they were helpful? know, did they like, did they do a lot for you? I've heard mixed reviews from different agencies who were just like, you know, I paid them a couple thousand bucks, but you know, they got me, they told me to send an email and then I sent an email and then the rest happened.
Marine Kinna (35:28.178)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (35:32.71)
Yeah, that's it. Yeah. I would say the thing is that I don't, I do think that the resources are not out there. So they were helping my first year when I got recruited. I understood everything. And then I was like, this is what I paid for. I was like, I could have done that myself. But like, I do think that it's, it's nice to have someone that
know the process to talk to if you have questions because parents get worried. Like they're sending their kid all the way in the other part of the world. And so it's like, how do you know if it's legit? Yeah, so that was the first worry. But since my dad kind of knew about it, I already have him. But I do think that I could have done without it if I have made more research into it.
Mark Burik (36:31.052)
Okay, like a few YouTube videos or whatnot.
Marine Kinna (36:33.806)
Yeah, if I had, but I do think that those resources don't exist at the moment yet. But yeah.
Mark Burik (36:40.11)
Which is why, which is for anybody who's listening, this is part of the development that we're going in. Since Marine has that experience and has gone through it, the next level of Better at Beach coming in 2025 is going to be helping juniors, number one, fix their game and their lifting and their...
Strategy and technique to be able to get to that college level So we're gonna have a dedicated juniors program that we can help online and help them lifting and help with their technique and do video reviews as well as Get the tutelage of marine and other players who have gone through the recruiting and college process so if you are listening if you think that this is Somebody that maybe you know or somebody who's interested in
Please turn them onto our podcast because the next few episodes, we're going to be talking with Marine and we're going to be bringing on some other NCAA players who have been through this both international and domestic process. And we're going to continue to develop that. And then we're going to make it into a little online program and a course so that, Hey, here you go. We're, you know, we're not going to be this gigantic agency, but we will get you to where you need to be and answer all of the questions and we'll have weekly meetings so that you can come and talk to a person.
whenever you want and use our community to talk to people who will answer questions quickly. So if that's something you're interested in or you know somebody who is starting to get to that level, please send them our way, prepare for 2025. It's gonna take a long time to build and do it right, but that is the next step in the evolution of Better at Beach to start helping juniors get to college. Okay, so you're there, you've now...
Hired this agency. He's telling you what's, what's the first step getting video or.
Marine Kinna (38:31.602)
Mm
Marine Kinna (38:37.096)
So the first step was they watched my video and from there they got to kind of evaluate me on what type of scholarship they think I could get. Just think those are not valuable people. They're watching me play. But my thing was, yeah, my thing was if I don't get a full scholarship, I can go.
Mark Burik (38:58.007)
Yikes.
Marine Kinna (39:04.072)
I, that was mandatory. can get free school in France. So, in my mind, he was like, you get me free school. I will go. If I don't get that, I will figure my way out in France. I didn't want to put that amount of money on my family knowing that French university is free. All right. So it's.
Mark Burik (39:18.744)
Okay.
Marine Kinna (39:30.088)
it's we don't have this thing like I we're not ready to take a loan for like 1000, $1 ,000 knowing I could get really good education here. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, exactly. So once I said that, I, they were like, okay, then it might be a little difficult, but I was like, okay, then let's just try. I gave I created a video. And I
Mark Burik (39:36.066)
Hundreds of thousands, yeah.
Marine Kinna (39:57.816)
they should have done a better job. Honestly, I never made a video. So I was like, what do need to put? Like the highlights? I wasn't sure honestly, how it worked. I created a video. It was fine. I needed to give them like my choices of location in the US I would have to I wanted to go. I
Mark Burik (40:26.146)
which is tough already.
Marine Kinna (40:27.31)
Yeah, I was like, yeah, and I was like, okay, I'll pick only the one I knew it was like California, Florida, like I picked the really nice one. And after that, you need as an international, you need to pass, depending on what which country you're from, it kind of differ. But for France, I had to pass the TOEFL. And the essay, the TOEFL is just
a test, like it's a four hour test who gives you a score and evaluate your English. Yeah, and depending on the score you get, then each school in the US, each university has a minimum score that you have to have for that specific test. And if you don't get that score, then you can't get it that school, for example.
Mark Burik (41:02.439)
okay.
Mark Burik (41:17.912)
So first things first, learn English. Huh, that's such a good point, you can't. Okay, have you experienced other players that were so budgeted at English? I know that we had a Brazilian play for George Mason, who, no shot, her Spanish friend from Puerto Rico was doing all of her homework.
Marine Kinna (41:20.122)
learning English. Yeah. Huge. Yeah. But wait,
Marine Kinna (41:34.056)
100 % I was gonna say no offense to Brazilia, but yeah.
Yeah, yeah, no, it's so you need to have a minimum of that. And then I did the SAT. So like someone's SAT day of the year, I forgot which year was like in 2016, the same SAT that someone would take in high school, I had to do the same knowing I never studied in English. Like, we'll see what happens. But they do give you like books and everything that you can study. But
going but the TOEFL score is the most important one. But each school has kind of their requirements for international students. So when I got recruited, my English, I would say was better than average as a French person because my dad was speaking English, my sister loves the USA. So I always was listening into English, like the movies, I would always watch like YouTube video in English.
So my earring, I could understand it very well, but I would not speak as fluently as obviously I'm speaking now. But I could understand it very well. But what happened is I messed up my test. So when I did my test, you're in a room with 30 other people and you have a writing part.
Mark Burik (42:58.979)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (43:08.712)
a earring part, you're listening and then a speaking part. And I was really good at earring. And when I was listening, the person next to me was doing their speaking. So when I tell you my brain was just fried because they were speaking so loud and I was trying to listen and I was like, my God, this is the worst. That was terrible. That was terrible because it's time. And so.
Mark Burik (43:29.474)
That's terrible. Yeah.
Marine Kinna (43:34.81)
whatever, like depending, they were going faster than me. So they were at the next part and then it kind of just messed me up. excuse. But anyway, my score was not as high as I hoped it was going to be. and honestly, compared to my level of English, it was not as high as it should have been. my freshman year, I actually got recruited in a Juco. So I went junior college. So
Mark Burik (44:00.118)
Okay, which is a junior college. Could you?
Expand on what a junior college difference is between a university and by the way, like college and university in, if you're listening internationally, university and college are essentially the same thing. So when we say college and university, we mean the exact same thing. there is little differences. Like when you talk about a game and a set in volleyball, it's like, yes, you can be more specific. But when we say university and college means the same thing. So you went to a junior college.
Marine Kinna (44:17.936)
Yeah, looks like same thing. Yeah.
Mark Burik (44:33.612)
And the difference between that is usually they're going to get you an associate's degree, which is about a two year degree, but not a full bachelor's. So they're getting you kind of half of way there or competent enough to be in the workforce. Okay.
Marine Kinna (44:37.648)
Mm -hmm. Two years. Yes.
Marine Kinna (44:45.84)
Yeah. Yeah. So as a volleyball player, usually when you spend time on a Juco, a junior college, then you can transfer that associate degree that you got to a four year. So you'll always already be like a sophomore and then you finish, you can finish your bachelor degree with those two years. But yeah, I get recruited in Colorado, middle of nowhere. It was Otero Junior College. It was in a city called La Junta.
which is about the biggest city was 30 minutes away, was Pueblo. So if you're from Colorado, you know how small that place is. I remember it was about two hours from Denver and I remember driving from the airport to that college the first time in the middle of the cows. This, this smell, I was just like, where am I going? No idea from France. Like,
I love Colorado now, I didn't know where Colorado was. Like, it was not one of those states that I heard about it, but I didn't know where it was in the US. Like, I had no idea where, what was there. So I go there and I, yeah, I went. yeah.
Mark Burik (46:03.512)
So you took it?
So, okay, so they gave, so you sent you a good enough recruiting video that a coach looked at it and said, yeah, come join our team. And good enough TOEFL scores, the English test scores, to get you over there competing for a college, a junior college.
Marine Kinna (46:11.516)
Good enough recruiting video.
Marine Kinna (46:16.455)
Yes.
Marine Kinna (46:25.468)
Yeah. So I forgot to mention junior college, their requirement is lower because those are two years and they're smaller schools. They usually help you like a lot of people that don't have a good English will end up in junior college first just to get their English right. and to be able to transfer. So that's what happened to me. I had, then I had meeting like video calls with the coach and then they end up
offering me a full scholarship, which I took and I left at 17 year old in August. I was like, here we go. Two weeks before I left, was like, I'm not going. I was like, this is scary. I'm going to be alone in Colorado. I don't know anyone. And I was like doubting myself, like my English, was like, how am going to survive? It was, but,
the day of I left and I actually was 17 years old. And when we were at the airport, they were like, you can't you can't go alone. Like you're 17 years old. And I was like, my god, panic mode. I passed security and they were like, you can't go alone. Like you need an authorization from your parents. So panicking, running to the airport needed to call my dad to come back to give me like a paper saying like, I'll authorize my child to go to the to the USA. But
It was really stressful because you're living by yourself on the other side of the world, basically.
Mark Burik (47:59.564)
Yeah, and airlines don't really tell you that. mean, some of them do now in the signup process, but they're like, okay, here's your date of birth. You need a paper. You need somebody to walk you past the security gate. You need somebody to pick you up at the arrival gate. I just went through that with my nephews and I was like, well, that's good. But also the airlines don't exactly make that loud and clear.
Marine Kinna (48:11.995)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (48:16.05)
Yeah.
No. And that also what my, the agency I went through, they didn't tell me, like they knew I was like 17 and that was, so it was, it was pretty, I was pretty panicking, but then I was able to go.
Mark Burik (48:33.826)
How many emails did you send to different colleges or were they the ones specifically talking for you?
Marine Kinna (48:41.37)
Yes, so they were the one sending the email. I'm not sure how many emails. But could have been one could have been I don't know. But I've heard now that I've been in college, and I've heard from other coaches, and I've also helped some French girls come to the US. It's better to use or your personal email, or an email that's like with a first name, not directly from an agency.
Mark Burik (48:47.992)
Could have been one.
Mark Burik (49:01.186)
Great.
Marine Kinna (49:10.288)
just because they get, see the agency email and they're like, okay, we have so many of those. Yeah. So when it's like a personalized email, when they care about the school, they actually made research and everything. And those are the emails are usually coaches are going to look more for.
Mark Burik (49:17.142)
Really?
Mark Burik (49:33.92)
Okay, so no blanket statements, no anything. I suppose you could like fake it at this point with chat GPT saying, I'm sending an email, please do research, this college, but yeah.
Marine Kinna (49:41.736)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I do think you can get recruited the other way. But if you really want something, if you really want a specific school, include that in the email. 100 percent.
Mark Burik (49:57.87)
Got it. Okay. So put your name on your email address and make sure that you send personal outreach and then coaches, everybody coaches get hundreds, not thousands of these. So if you don't hear back from them the first time, send 30 more, just copy paste because most of the time they're just scrolling and they see it or they're too busy one day. And this is, you know, kind of basic marketing, but
Marine Kinna (50:03.664)
Yeah. Yeah.
Marine Kinna (50:25.682)
Mm
Mark Burik (50:26.88)
If you hear crickets the first time, it doesn't mean it's cause they're not interested in it they have a full -time job and a family and current athletes that they're working with. And some of them only have one person on their coaching staff to handle all of those hundreds of emails. So just for anything in life, but for definitely for this, for getting recruited or for getting a job, continue to pester and don't feel like you're pestering them. Just assume.
Marine Kinna (50:37.031)
Mm
thousands.
Mark Burik (50:54.296)
They probably didn't see it. They're probably slammed and so busy. So maybe I sent it on the wrong day at the wrong hour. So I'm just going to keep trying until they give me the no or yes response. But when you don't hear a response, my recommendation is continue to call email text until at least you get a response and then hear from them. But if you don't hear anything, just keep going. Copy paste, send again.
Marine Kinna (50:57.618)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (51:05.106)
Mm -hmm.
Marine Kinna (51:17.768)
100%. Yeah. Get a no, get to people to say no. Yeah. But anyway, so I get recruited and then I need now, need, was still in France at that time. I need to get into school. So I just need to do regular admission process through the website. They just ask you for documents. You just do the admission process.
Mark Burik (51:26.818)
I like that.
Marine Kinna (51:47.752)
And from there, when I got admitted to my school, then I can apply for my student visa. Yeah, so from the student visa, you they give you a requirement. They give you like a to do list that you need to do. Once you apply it and put all the documents they ask you to put and everything, then you apply for an interview. So in the interview, then you have to go to the.
Mark Burik (51:54.54)
Okay.
Marine Kinna (52:17.038)
U .S. Embassy in France, for example. Yes, you have to go there. So for me, it was in Paris. I am from the south of France. So it was a travel. Like I needed to go travel. You go to your appointment just to file paperwork because they it's basically an interview. They ask you what are you going to do there? What are you going to study? How are you going to pay for this? And
Mark Burik (52:32.3)
just to file paperwork.
Marine Kinna (52:45.466)
The most important thing is like, you planning on staying in the US? And yeah, because they basically want you to have something to come back in your country because they want you to get your study, go back to your country, basically.
Mark Burik (52:50.657)
Hmm.
Mark Burik (53:03.896)
That's so interesting. Why would we educate, spend resources and like American resources to educate somebody and then kick them out again? To me that just seems so backwards. Anyway, go on. Yeah.
Marine Kinna (53:19.878)
Yeah, there's the system. It is what it is. basically the most important thing is showing, for example, I had a full scholarship. So you could see on the paperwork I had from the school admission and then it shows my scholarship amount. But then I still needed to show some type of funding for living life.
You know, like, yes, I had the food cover, I had housing cover, but it's like, okay, but you still need something just in case if anything happened. I needed to show some type of funding that I had.
Mark Burik (53:48.045)
Mm.
Mark Burik (54:00.839)
that you have enough money to like fly back if you get expelled or something like that.
Marine Kinna (54:03.196)
To fly back, yes, yes. They don't want people to just become homeless. For example, to just be out of money and can't, yeah, be stuck in the US. Yes.
Mark Burik (54:13.186)
be stuck in the US and yeah. Okay. So that's like a bank account thing.
Marine Kinna (54:19.592)
Yeah, the bank statement or your bank saying like, for example, like I was 17, I never worked, I don't have any money. mom, like my bank made a statement that my mom will be responsible with her accounts of me if anything happened, for example. But again, this will be written down of
every paperwork that you need to bring. It's pretty straightforward. Honestly, it's just a lot of paperwork to fill. You have to go to the embassy. Once you are at the embassy and you had a successful interview, they take your passport and you go back home. And after that, after two weeks, usually receive your passport and then you have your visa in it. It's your student visa. Once you have your student visa, then you can
leave to the US and you're fine basically.
Mark Burik (55:22.338)
The next question that I have for you have a student visa, but, and they want you to have enough money in your account to be able to survive. But is it true that you can't work while being in the U S as a, as a student visa so that like, you actually can't even provide for yourself legally while you're getting an education. Is that true?
Marine Kinna (55:50.94)
Yeah, unfortunately, yes, yes and no. So basically your first semester, you're not allowed to work at all. They want you to get into the system, understand the system of the US, of the school and everything. I believe after your first semester of freshman year, you're allowed to work for the school.
Mark Burik (56:19.874)
Okay.
Marine Kinna (56:19.984)
So you can work, I don't know, there's a couple student jobs depending on your school, like during a tour or, but also keep in mind, you're busy. Like it's not that, like you have to, you have practice every single day, you have classes in a new language, you have homework. It's not that easy to just go and work.
Mark Burik (56:26.615)
Mm.
Mark Burik (56:33.709)
Yeah, yeah.
Mark Burik (56:47.16)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (56:47.556)
It's more made for people that don't have sport, like other students that don't have sport.
Mark Burik (56:52.898)
Yeah. I was just thinking I had to work three, four jobs in college and work during the summer just to make sure that I had, you know, everything else set and it seems so unfair to. Yeah. Okay.
Marine Kinna (57:03.826)
which is insane. Yeah, it's insane. But so my freshman year, I didn't work and I didn't have a lot of expenses like everything. I was lucky that everything was covered for me. So my expenses were very, very little. But after my freshman year, my English was great. I was lucky that I landed in a college
Colorado in the middle of nowhere, but I loved it. Honestly, I would have stayed if the volleyball level was better because the people were awesome. I was the only French person in the university, which I, in few months, I had to communicate. I obviously like my English got better so fast. Yeah, like a couple months, I was basically fluent.
Mark Burik (57:55.864)
Fast, yeah.
Marine Kinna (58:01.836)
which I'm so grateful for that because next story, when I transferred, I didn't transfer because I wanted to have better volleyball. I was playing a junior college. We were good. I tried to, I started understanding the indoor system, how, NGC double A, which is the Juco.
Then there is NAIA, then there is NCAA division three, NCAA division two, NCAA division one. Before that, I had no idea. Like before my freshman year, no idea how it worked. yeah. They just, they just said, they like NCAA, everyone is like, NCAA D1, NCAA D1, not thinking like there is other things. but I started making my research and
Mark Burik (58:41.014)
Even before you're doing this process, you didn't know D1, D2, D3, and AI. Okay. Huh.
Marine Kinna (58:57.506)
I wanted to transfer to have better volleyball. I love the people, but I came for volleyball. I wanted to pursue that and go into a better team. So after my freshman year, which is not really common for a junior college, not a lot of people transfer after their freshman year, because I basically didn't finish my associate's degree. I started making a new video and this time I asked other people.
How do you do it? What do I need to put? And then I made a highlight video. And then on the side, I had a full game ready to send to coaches. So they see me. How do I react? Yes, yes. But first, to make myself look good, will always send a highlight. When they show interest, then I will say, here is a full game.
Mark Burik (59:43.202)
between points, the interactions, what's your body language?
Mark Burik (59:55.988)
Mm -hmm. Here's a taste. I'll give you the whole meal if you're interested. Okay.
Marine Kinna (59:56.876)
And yes, yeah. And I was lucky that in my junior college, was a full around outside hitter. So I had a couple like rewards. I forgot exactly. Yes, I'm playing indoor. I'm playing indoor. Yeah, so outside hitter, all tournament around the tournament awards or couple of words. So it looked good. It looked better because now
Mark Burik (01:00:09.932)
we're still playing indoor. You're not even playing beach volleyball yet. My gosh. Okay.
Marine Kinna (01:00:26.226)
coaches see that I'm in the American system, they understand everything and they can see my stats from the junior college website and everything. I get contacted by multiple schools. I got a couple D1 offers and I got a couple D2 offers from my indoor. And one of them actually offered me to play beach and indoor.
but they wanted me to stay another year and finish my associate degree. But I wanted to leave, honestly. I loved it, but I just wanted to have a better volleyball. So I got recruited at Lynn University, which is in Boca Raton. It's a Division II, but it's a top 25 Division II program in the country. And yes.
Mark Burik (01:01:20.854)
And just so everybody who is listening, if you don't know division one, division two, division three, those are all NCAA. Division one is essentially a dedication of finances by the university to their sport programs. So it's as much funding as you can get. and that, that usually translates into, have more scholarship, more athletic scholarship money available. D2 has some scholarships, and there's a little bit less.
time that's mandatory for practice and training from the athletes. And then D3 is essentially one season and they're not allowed to do too much like off season training. And there's usually no scholarships, but they might still have academic scholarships. And in AIA, I don't think anybody knows any rules that they have. could be a 35 year old professional athlete who just finished in the Olympics and go to college.
Marine Kinna (01:02:15.112)
you
Yeah, Yeah, yeah, yeah. NCAA D3, they actually don't have any athletic scholarship. So for international, it's kind of hard to go to those just because it's kind of what we're hoping for. But in D1 and D2 and NAIA, they have a lot of athletic scholarship, especially like at that time for indoor. They had a lot of scholarship for that. So I get recruited.
in a division two in Florida. the, know that I understood the process. It was a lot easier for me to get recruited. I personally emailed school and I found that one, which was actually their, their record was, was pretty bad, but it was in Florida. I wanted the sun. It was closer to France, which was only like a eight hour flight.
Mark Burik (01:03:16.173)
Mm -mm.
Marine Kinna (01:03:16.392)
and only six hours time difference. And the school itself was amazing. And they offered me a full scholarship also. Yeah, so I was able to fly my second year and start my new university, my sophomore year and a university. So now it was a four year university. Knowing I already did one year, then I only had three years left.
of eligibility for indoor. Going there honestly was amazing. I really struggled my freshman, not my sophomore year because you play with players that are actually really older than you. There was players that were five years older because they were seniors or grad students. And I was just an 18 year old sophomore. And I was young, young sophomore because in France, like since I'm born at the end of the year, like
Mark Burik (01:04:09.6)
A young sophomore, yeah.
Marine Kinna (01:04:15.834)
you it's a little different than the US. I'm still in the same school, the grade school as someone that will be born in January 1st. So it's no matter what year, if you're born the same year as one person, then you're going to be in the same class. So I graduated early for an American for the American system. So I'm a young sophomore. And it was it was great. I had actually a really hard time because
I was such an all around player in my junior college. Now they only recruited all around players. So I'm not an anchor anymore. I'm not the one carrying the team. So it was, it was really tough and my sophomore year. and then I had a change of mindset, worked really hard, improve my, jump from, I don't know, 10 inches, I think I'm not sure exactly, but.
Mark Burik (01:04:55.459)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (01:05:14.84)
huge improvement in my jump. then the next year, my junior year, we come back, I play and then we win the first trophy for the school for volleyball, which was amazing. And I was the first first team All -American for that school in volleyball. Yeah, which was incredible. Honestly. Yes.
Mark Burik (01:05:28.077)
Wow.
Mark Burik (01:05:32.364)
There!
If you could pinpoint in one sentence the difference, the difference that brought your vertical up. So you decided, okay, I got to get more physical, I guess. If you could say in one sentence what the major change was, what was that physical dedication that brought the new vertical?
Marine Kinna (01:05:48.881)
Yes.
Marine Kinna (01:05:58.202)
working out, honestly. I, I, and that's the thing that they don't tell you in college before you get recruited is you're actually going to work out a lot. Like they're going to push you and it's up to you if you want to get better at something. I knew that I wasn't happy of where I was in my volleyball career. I wanted to be that top player. wanted to be the leader of the team.
Mark Burik (01:06:19.128)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (01:06:28.744)
But I knew I needed to get physical and I knew by getting physical, I'm going to get confident and by being confident, I'm going to score. So it's all linked up. So my off season in the spring when I'm still playing indoor in the spring, this is when off season is I grind it. I really I was on top of it at practice, working out.
Mark Burik (01:06:35.938)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (01:06:54.98)
And we had great coaches because in the college team you get trainers. And it was amazing, honestly. yeah, I do think that that was the biggest difference. And I do think that it helped a lot in my confidence on the court. And I am not, I don't like to work out, honestly. Like, let's be honest, like I just knew I needed to do that to be able to get to the level.
Mark Burik (01:07:23.0)
Okay. And they, in your French high school, wasn't a big, there wasn't a big dedication to lifting. Hmm.
Marine Kinna (01:07:31.182)
No, we had maybe once a week. They didn't teach me how to hang clean, hurt my shoulder. That's exactly what happened. now, unfortunately, like, because I didn't learn the right technique, hand cleans, like, are not, like, not good for my body, because every time I will do one, I'll get hurt. So yeah, which was really important. think that
Mark Burik (01:07:52.792)
You're yanking something. Yeah.
Marine Kinna (01:07:59.432)
to learn proper technique and working out, I think it's huge because I do think that lifting weights, it's great. It can really help you on the court, but if you don't have the proper technique, then it can actually can hurt pretty bad. Yeah.
Mark Burik (01:08:13.933)
Yeah. Quick pause for a commercial break. If you guys are listening and you are interested in just bumping up your physicality as well, we have two programs for you. One of them is a 60 day max vertical, but the other one is our 21 day mobility and strength foundations program. And that's where we give you really simple mobility and body weight moves and very lightweight
strengthening exercises and in the videos they're they're follow along with me videos We give you all of the technical reminders we tell you to start with lightweight and we coach you through the videos and If you're in the complete player program where you can post on our private community Every time you do one of those workouts you just post a couple of reps and say hey am I doing this right? Do you guys have any tips? for better technique and then
We go in there and we coach you and we give you those reminders so that you can learn how to work out before we get you into that big meaty program, which is the 60 day max vertical. So 60 day has some more options for higher level lifts, but the three week, 21 day mobility program, it'll get you started and it'll get you off your butt. It starts with just body weight and light bands. And then we move you up to just like very light dumbbells.
so that you can start that strength base, get your technique, you can go through it once, you can go through it twice if that's what makes you comfortable. And then we start moving you up to some higher level plyometrics and heavier weights, which will then show their benefit in your game. So if you're interested in that, head to betteratbeach .com. We've got the 6a max vertical, or you can just get started with a three week, 21 day program. And I promise you, it is easy enough for anyone, my grandma, to follow.
start there, fix any old pains, fix any immobility problems where you might be tight or you might be sore somewhere. It's very much a rehab program. So that 21 day program is what I use to come back from a broken foot in three weeks time to be able to play the Potsdam rumble, which is a very arduous, crazy, long, grass doubles tournament. So,
Mark Burik (01:10:31.03)
If it worked for me coming back from a broken foot, it'll work for you starting from zero. So I highly recommend that program if you're interested. And you can see from Marine's experience, adding, lifting gets our game to a complete other level. And so I highly recommend that you learn the right way if you don't have a trainer or if you just want to work with somebody online and people who know volleyball. You're more than welcome bringing on the Complete Player program. Okay.
That's our commercial break. But so then you played indoor for how long did you play indoor?
Marine Kinna (01:11:02.728)
You
Marine Kinna (01:11:07.08)
So I played, had.
Three, technically two season plus COVID.
Mark Burik (01:11:18.188)
Okay, right. Whatever that counts as.
Marine Kinna (01:11:19.656)
So yeah, but my, so certain school had different rules during COVID, but during COVID we were not allowed to play, to compete at all. So I didn't have any, which was kind of sad because the year before summer junior year, we win the first trophy and we had the same really similar team for my senior year. And we were like, this is the year we're going to go win national and then COVID.
Mark Burik (01:11:29.538)
Hmm.
Mark Burik (01:11:48.216)
Damn.
Marine Kinna (01:11:48.707)
It was really hard. I never actually had a senior season with that team and growing up with a team from if you're the same class of age and growing up with them and seeing the improvement is amazing. Honestly, it's so cool to play with those girls and get along and having the same goal and really believing that you can win. And that's something that French people were pretty not.
Mark Burik (01:12:13.059)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (01:12:18.332)
Like always think of the worst, not think of the worst, we never like, I think that's, that's the American mindset is believing that we can win it. Everyone thinks they're going to go professional. Everyone thinks we're going to be the best in the world. And that was amazing, honestly, but unfortunately COVID hit. So I didn't have my indoor season. That's when I started playing beach. Yes. Yeah. So.
Mark Burik (01:12:44.034)
How did that come about? Had you ever played beach before?
Marine Kinna (01:12:47.896)
My sophomore year, I usually go home. a season, the season of indoor is usually from August till December. In December, I go home to France for a Christmas break. Then I go back in January, January till May is off season for indoor. And then I go home for the summer until I have to go back. Every summer, there is like a French league.
Couple tournament in France and I started playing that my sophomore year Just I'm an outside hitter. I'm one of my Strength is being fast. I improved my jump I love being in the sand. That's fun. I started playing but more like indoor ish Player don't really have a lot of beach technique But knowing that
Mark Burik (01:13:41.624)
Mm.
Marine Kinna (01:13:46.52)
I knew that I wanted to do my master. I wanted to get an MBA and beach volleyball in the NCAA is considered a different sport. So if you didn't know in the NCAA, you get four years of eligibility in one sport, and then you get an extra fifth year in a different sport, which is great for volleyball players because we
Mark Burik (01:14:11.245)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (01:14:14.78)
volleyball and beach volleyball are similar. So I did technically four years of indoor and I got recruited for beach volleyball my fifth year. But before that COVID hit, I had couple a video from France for me playing on the French tour that I created and I was able to send. But this time I only did it by myself, my recruitment for
beach volleyball, the NCAA, because I knew the system. I knew what I needed to do. I knew what I needed to put in my video. And I already know all the visa requirements and everything. So I did by myself. And I think that was the easiest recruitment I ever done. I wish I would have done it before. But during the fall season, did not have indoor practice.
I started playing beach volleyball. I met DJ. He helped me. He helped me a lot because he was already playing and practicing in Florida. So he was I learned a lot from him. Played couple tournaments with Sarah Putt. I also yeah, that's how I got recruited. But so I with Sarah Putt. I play with Sarah Putt and I
Mark Burik (01:15:29.409)
No way.
Man, hope better at Beach family before.
Marine Kinna (01:15:40.112)
We played against Larissa and Lili. If you don't know Larissa, she is one of the top player ever for Brazil. Yeah, I think yes. And we lose a game, but we go to tiebreak. But yes, it was my first semester actually playing, but I'm really competitive.
Mark Burik (01:15:49.782)
If not the, I think she's the most decorated player in history, right?
Mark Burik (01:16:01.538)
What?
Marine Kinna (01:16:10.098)
So I will fight. It's ugly, but I will fight and I will try to make it work. And I still play volleyball. I'm a good indoor player. I have some skills. I'm not new to volleyball. I'm just new to beach volleyball. And I was, yeah, yeah.
Mark Burik (01:16:27.694)
Sure. And Florida is pretty jumpy. So there's some help from the sand for indoor players because it's pretty thin, but still.
Marine Kinna (01:16:35.528)
Yeah, so I at that time, I was playing left side blocker. So I send my video again. So when I had my French video, I sent it over to the top 25 school in the country for beach volleyball. I got a couple answer. They're like, we'd like to see more. Do you have more recent video? Because this was before COVID since during that summer, there was nothing really I didn't play.
Mark Burik (01:17:01.539)
Hmm.
Nobody has recent video.
Marine Kinna (01:17:05.864)
Yeah, yeah. So I wanted to practice, I wanted to get recruited, and I knew I needed a full scholarship to keep going or I was going home. I make video and I send that one video with Sarah Putt to same thing, top 20 school. I'm sending again, same thing. And I immediately in the next five minutes, I get answer from LMU, UCLA.
Mark Burik (01:17:15.853)
Mm.
Marine Kinna (01:17:36.136)
Stetson and I forgot which one but I had good and I was like, wait a second, like I'm not that good at the telephone. But so yeah, so I got offered from, I had a full scholarship from Stetson, which is in Florida, which at the time was a top 20 in the country. I got an offer from LMU, which was
top five in the country. And I got an offer from UCLA, which is also top five in the country, which was insane. but I'm lucky that I had did it. kind of knew he knew the coaches there. So as soon as I got that offer from LMU and I told him who the coach was, who was John Mayer, he was like, you have to go there. He was like, there's no way. And I had a really good
Mark Burik (01:18:10.638)
Thank you.
Marine Kinna (01:18:34.706)
feeling with the coach. love talking to John. Betsy was assistant coach at the time. So it was amazing. And I also had a call with UCLA and everyone is like, UCLA, how can you say no to UCLA? Which I really hesitated, but they did not offer me housing, which it was still doable. And I had a better feeling with the coaches from LMU.
Mark Burik (01:18:56.024)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (01:19:04.87)
Honestly, and there I also I had off campus housing, was great. So I went and got recruited at LMU, which was insane. I can't believe I just started playing beach volleyball.
Mark Burik (01:19:10.295)
Nice.
Mark Burik (01:19:18.262)
Yeah. And for them to recruit for only one year, like knowing that you're only going to be there for one year.
Marine Kinna (01:19:23.898)
Yeah, so.
Yes, and that's the thing of LMU. At the time I got recruited, it was a really growing program and they were trying to find this little gem in certain school to be able to build a strong team and kind of invest more in the grad players to be able to have a higher ranked and then have better recruits coming in.
Mark Burik (01:19:45.314)
Mm
Mark Burik (01:19:56.147)
So they were thinking long term. That's smart. Okay.
Marine Kinna (01:19:57.926)
They were thinking long term. Yeah, that's great for me. yeah, so I easier to recommend ever. Honestly, I just sent emails. I got on a couple of calls, got offered. And next thing you know, I'm in California playing beach volleyball, left side blocker, actually, which is funny because
Mark Burik (01:20:23.34)
You
Marine Kinna (01:20:26.884)
If you don't know me now as a player, I'm a right side defender. I got recruited as a left side blocker, did my entire fall off season, which is in NCAA. D1 off season is from August till December. You start playing in December and then the season is from February till May. And season January come back, we come back from winter break. I become a right side defender.
Mark Burik (01:20:30.721)
you
Mark Burik (01:20:48.792)
Hmm.
Marine Kinna (01:20:56.912)
never played a defense in my life. But it was great. I'm so glad, honestly. But yeah, that was my college experience. So, so anyone listening, I did junior college, division two indoor, division one beach volleyball. And long story short, but I also ended up playing my last year, my COVID year in NAIA. So it just show you out there how it doesn't really matter.
what division you play for, you don't need to go play in the best NCAA D1. I was an all -American indoor for a D2. I was an all -American D1 for a B2B. And I am the same person. I think anyone can play anywhere. The school that you play for, it's not who you are. I think if you can make an impact on a program, like I believe I made an impact at that D2 program in indoor.
Mark Burik (01:21:37.646)
day.
Marine Kinna (01:21:53.626)
It's a lot more valuable than playing for a big D1 and being on the bench. And that's my biggest takeaway that I had in my college experience is you don't play, you want to play on the court. You want to find that school that where you're to have some playing time. It doesn't matter the name of the school, as long as you have fun and you improve. Yeah, that was.
Mark Burik (01:21:57.495)
Mmm.
Mark Burik (01:22:15.725)
Yeah.
Mark Burik (01:22:21.048)
And then you put in your own work on the side. I mean, as well as, you know, showing up to practice is the bare minimum. And if you know that you're going to that smaller school, I, if anyone thinks that Marina is an outlier, she is first of all. but for, for my history, I played a year and a half of club men's volleyball at university of Delaware. didn't have a men's team and I did the same. People were just like put together recruiting video.
Marine Kinna (01:22:23.366)
Yeah.
Marine Kinna (01:22:46.62)
Mm
Mark Burik (01:22:50.446)
see what you do, email a bunch of people and the coaches that I emailed, a bunch of them never got back. Some of them were brutally honest. They're like, all of our guys are touching 11 foot and you're only touching 10, 10 right now. And I was just like, okay, so that's it, like over. but the place I ended up going to George Mason.
they didn't respond until I sent last ditch emails in like July when I had sent out all of my tape in I think maybe April and May. And my mom was like, hey, isn't that something that you really want to go for? Don't you think you should give it one more shot? And so I sent something and it must have hit him at the right time because he didn't see the first two or three emails. And he goes, hey, there's actually still time to transfer.
send me something else. Let me see. And it was just like, well, you don't know how to play volleyball, but you're athletic. So maybe we can teach you in a, a, in a couple of years. And that was it. I'll pack my bags and it's like, okay, let's go to this new school and then grind away and, same thing. wherever you're playing first, just work your tail off. And then you can take those stepping stones. And if you feel like you're behind, cause you didn't play four years of, you know,
Juniors tournaments in the US because I never played a single club tournament in high school, right? Didn't have a single club practice I played for half a year of my high school season and then it was all the other sports but You took the stepping stones work your tail off go and then when you don't hear responses Just beat down their door and make them kick you out of the office The negative to that is that you like in both ways you don't ever see them again
Marine Kinna (01:24:10.984)
Mm
Marine Kinna (01:24:27.4)
Yeah.
Mark Burik (01:24:33.61)
If you don't hear a response and you don't get an email, you don't ever see them again. If they say, no, you're not good enough to be here. Okay, great. Then I'm out and I'm onto the next office. So just keep sending them and force that person to say no. They don't look badly on you. They just recognize you as somebody who hustles at least in one part of their life. So the good part about you knocking on somebody's doors is they go, you know, if they have tried this hard just to get my attention.
Marine Kinna (01:24:33.616)
Yeah, it was the worst thing. Yeah.
Mark Burik (01:25:01.774)
Maybe it's somebody who really wants it and coaches are always looking for people who really want it. and that's one indicator, you know, cause they, they do get some of those athletic rock stars that are skilled and athletic, but don't really want to be there. that happens on a lot of teams. So to have somebody who's maybe less athletic, but desperately wants to be there. Yeah. I'll take that guy nine out 10 times.
Marine Kinna (01:25:07.4)
100%. Yeah.
Marine Kinna (01:25:27.368)
No, and your mindset and I think that's also what GammaGarCrew did in multiple places is I really believed in the team that we're playing in. I gave everything I had in practice. I was always on top of it. I always early at practice. I will always work really hard. I was one of those players that is going to work really hard and you're going to see it. I'm going to fail. Yeah, but one day it's going to pay off. And I think that
Mark Burik (01:25:51.714)
Yeah. What did hard work look like for you? Was it extra reps? Was it winning the races like in conditioning? What lifting extra?
Marine Kinna (01:26:01.608)
I, everything, I would always like we had an indoor, you do run a lot of suicides. if people don't know what suicides are, it's you basically run to and line to a line then to end line to 10 foot line back and forth until whatever number. And you have to go on to under a certain second.
Mark Burik (01:26:31.009)
Mm.
Marine Kinna (01:26:31.272)
I would go until throwing up. I will be the one that's like really hard working. If we had testing day, I will go until my body can't anymore. that's, I think what coaches liked about me is that I always worked hard and I don't complain.
That's what made me a leader and that's what made me a great player and a good teammate is I will always push people around me to work harder because I will tell them work harder than me. I will be like, okay, you work hard, okay, work harder than me. You want to be better than me then work harder than me. And yeah, and it's silly, but when I see and I have the proof actually,
Mark Burik (01:27:17.915)
Put in more hours, put in more time, run faster.
Marine Kinna (01:27:26.728)
my junior year, one of my roommates, she came in, she was a freshman, 6 '2", from Canada. So nice, but really frail, but so talented. And she came with another group of freshmen. But I took her under my wing and I was like, you're not gonna do what they're gonna do. You're not gonna go out all the time. You're gonna go and work hard. The year after I left, she was the leader of the team. She became an All -American.
And then to that day, she calls me and she like, thank you. She's like, it's because I had someone like you to show me the path that I was able to do what I did. And it's okay to not have that person. You're not going to have that person everywhere, but you have yourself. I didn't have someone to push me. I hit rock bottom and I was like, okay, I don't like it out there. And then I was able to.
Mark Burik (01:28:22.106)
Yeah
Marine Kinna (01:28:25.768)
to go up from there, but I do think that coming, playing in the US and going to college was one of the best decisions I made. It got me here. It's been eight years now. It's just insane. And I found my way around. I found my way to stay. I found a way to work through volleyball while I was a junior.
Mark Burik (01:28:35.17)
Mm.
Marine Kinna (01:28:53.092)
It was mandatory for me to do an internship. So I was able to find an internship through my school and work unpaid. From there, I just worked my way around until here. Working for a better pitch. Yeah.
Mark Burik (01:29:08.46)
Yeah. Nice. And we're happy to have you.
Cool. Cool. What a story. Inspiring, to say the least. It fires me up. Hearing all of that detail fires me up even more than I already was to be on our team.
Marine Kinna (01:29:19.431)
Yeah.
Mark Burik (01:29:34.242)
Just want to thank you for finally saying yes. I think I followed my own advice by sending you a message or an email every two months. mean, like, you want to come to our team yet? Do you really like that other job? Cool. Yeah, and guys, if you are listening, we're going to do a few more episodes about this, but we are also going to start a program that's meant to help both internationals and juniors.
Marine Kinna (01:29:43.336)
For my now.
Mark Burik (01:30:04.19)
navigate their way through college, especially the parents who are getting their nervous and you can run around and I know from my circle of friends that are putting their kids into programs and figuring out where to get lessons and what clubs and how to contact colleges and like one of my good friends, he just sent his daughter to college after, you know, four years of him calling me every three months being like, I don't know what to do. I don't know what to do. but we found the way and he had me to lean on.
And a lot of people don't have those connections of people who have been through it, of people who have personal connections to all of those college coaches and understand the landscape. So I really encourage you guys to follow along as we embark on this journey. And we keep trying to help make that easier for parents and juniors and just, you know, get rid of all the big, scary imaginary monsters and say, here's the easy way, you know, just try this.
So I'm excited for that program and the evolution and, Marine's future work in that. And, if you are not following her on Instagram, Marine, what's your Instagram account?
Marine Kinna (01:31:15.036)
What's my name here? Maureen Kiena. Just my full name. You can find me. Feel free to message me any question. Honestly, I have a lot of people messaging me about me being in the U .S., how it works, how I did it. I always answer. So feel free to message me. I would love to help.
Mark Burik (01:31:16.45)
There it is.
Mark Burik (01:31:36.206)
Cool. And she will be in all of our Facebook groups and we will get her to as many camps as we can, but she's going to also be busy in the mothership organizing those camps. So, when we can get her as a coach, we will, but, she's got bigger fish to fry with us and, you will see a lot of her and she's currently competing on the ABP and, she's here in Hermosa beach and her DJ or
Marine Kinna (01:31:46.512)
Hehehehe
Mark Burik (01:32:06.03)
playing in the dark as me and my wife saw the strand. We saw your lights set up and I was just like, what is going on? They set up lights on the poles in Hermosa beach and we're playing at night and me and my wife were on our date night and I was just like, this is DJ too. But it was cool to see.
Marine Kinna (01:32:09.894)
Okay
Marine Kinna (01:32:15.324)
Hehehehehe
Marine Kinna (01:32:23.314)
You didn't see.
Marine Kinna (01:32:28.072)
Yeah, not enough sunlight during the day, we have to find a way.
Mark Burik (01:32:34.728)
Yeah, I guess so. Cool. All right, guys, from me, from our new team member, Marine, I hope you really enjoy this. I loved this episode. If you did too, please make sure that you subscribe. Like it, follow it wherever you are. And if you want to leave a comment or if you have questions on any of this, comment around the video, comment around the podcast and
Help us build a great program by asking all of the questions that you have, because without your questions, we can't build the best program possible. So we really encourage you to get involved in those comments, ask those questions, and then come on over to our Facebook group, which is volleyball tips for coaches, players, and parents. It's a free public Facebook group. And you can also ask any of those questions in there. And then when you join our program, you get our private Facebook group where we are in there.
constantly helping you with technique, strategy, all volleyball questions, and soon recruiting and college and international transfer questions. that's it, Maureen, anything else?
Marine Kinna (01:33:44.978)
No, that's it. Thank you for listening to that point.
Mark Burik (01:33:50.332)
All right, from all of us at Better at Beach, thanks for listening and we'll see you on the sand.
